Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
May
16
Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
“You Have To Be Prepared To Leave Your Daughter Without A Mother.”
“You have to be prepared to leave your daughter without a mother.” - OB to a mother who asked about VBAC options.
There are 28 comments to this post.
road2vba2c had this to say,
May 16, 2012 @ 10:38 am (Quote)
I take that risk everyday, doc. I have a higher risk of leaving my child motherless when I get in my car. Do you not realize that all of us are living on borrowed time? Whether or not you believe in a Higher Power, you have to understand that nothing is certain in this world. People die walking down the street. Your unscientific argument means nothing to me.
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Bonnie B Matheson had this to say,
May 16, 2012 @ 10:39 am (Quote)
It is not consent if you are too scared to say “No”. I hate it when doctors try to intimidate mothers. It is wrong. It is immoral. And they should be called out on it every single time they try it.
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Mama Wrench Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 3:01 pm (Quote)
If it doesn’t work for sex, it doesn’t work for medicine.
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Jen had this to say,
May 16, 2012 @ 10:40 am (Quote)
“You could be in a car accident. Before you drive, ask yourself if you’re prepared to leave your child without a mother.”
“You could fall and break your neck. Before going down stairs, ask yourself if you’re prepared to leave your child without a mother.”
“You could inhale something you’re allergic to and go into anaphylaxic shock. Before you breathe, ask yourself if you’re prepared to leave your child without a mother.”
Nothing is risk free. What are the actual risks? What can be done to minimize those risks? What are the alternatives and *their* risks? Which risks are you willing to take on, and which are you not? Scare tactics have no place in informed consent.
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I have to be prepared no matter what I do to leave my sons without a mom. I could stumble walking downstairs and break my neck. On my way to my appointment today, we had an idiot make a right to red just in front of us and another almost ran a red light and hit us coming home. Now how about you tell me my VBAC options, to better yet, give me my records because you’re fired!
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Numbers, doctor. Actual peer-reviewed studies with actual numbers.
Oh, look, these studies say the danger is in augmenting or inducing labor! Well, you’d never do those, right? Right?
And look, here’s the rate of spontaneous miscarriage with an amnio. You don’t do amnios, right? Oh, you do? Hmm.
I guess I’ll be seeing you for my non-augmented VBAC, then! Thanks, doc! I feel much easier now.
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Gee, thanks doc! I’ll go right now and make arrangements with the funeral home, increase my life insurance, quit my job, buy an RV and go on a cross country road trip to cross everything off my bucket list. You know, just to be prepared since you are so certain I will die doing this!
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I’ve had two VBACs and I’m perfectly BRRRAAIIIIINNNNNNSSSSSSS…
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Christie Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 6:23 pm (Quote)
hahahaha i was waiting for it,
ive also had a VBAC completely natural mind you, i dont remember dying but it could explain why i have no energy.. but it could also be a 2 year old and an 8 week old making me feel like death.. i guess we shall never know 
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…if you sign up for a repeat csection.”
I think the doctor forgot to finish his or her sentence!
(Higher risk of maternal death with a RCS than a VBAC.)
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OldMaman Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:32 am OldMaman(Quote)
Touche!
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Jennifer Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:32 am Jennifer(Quote)
Exactly this. There are risks both ways. Why are they never portrayed on the RCS side?
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VW Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:37 am VW(Quote)
Yeah, statistically speaking, you have to be prepared to leave your daughter without a sibling with a VBAC.
Which, in the absolute worst case scenario, is actually my personal preference. It’s a horrible terrible choice, but when it comes down to it, my daughter needs her mother more than a sibling.
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Dawn Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:43 am Dawn(Quote)
I don’t like that one either…
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Details Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 11:24 am Details(Quote)
I don’t understand your point. If I asked a doctor about VBAC and this was the first comment I got back I wouldn’t even bother arguing with the dumbass but get up and walk out. The truth is that pregnancy and birth have a certain risk. vaginal has a risk, c-section has a risk, abortion has a risk, just being pregnant can lead to some funky and distressing conditions before you ever go into labor and never having children increases your risks of certain things. Risk is a part of life. If a “professional” choose to try to scare me rather than discuss the risks in a rational manner I would walk away.
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Details Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 11:44 am Details(Quote)
VW: Are you saying that you believe that neonatal mortaltiy is higher with VBAC and that Maternal mortaltiy is higher with RCS? I don’t happen to think that is true, but if you do we should get somebody to look it up.
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Kathy Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 12:09 pm Kathy(Quote)
It’s been a while, so I’d have to see if I can find it (before someone else does) but I believe the risk of mom dying is 3x higher with an RCS than a VBAC. The risk of maternal death is still ridiculously small, but it is higher for an RCS.
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VW Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 12:27 pm VW(Quote)
Yes I remember something very similar. Essentially, the risk of death is higher for the baby with VBAC, and higher for the mother with RCS, at least in general terms. I think even the dreaded Dr A states this…she always talks about how she admires mothers who had c-sections because they chose to take on the additional risk to themselves
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Jane Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 2:36 pm Jane(Quote)
Higher than what, though?
Mother’s risk of death during VBAC > mother’s risk of death during RCS
Mother’s risk of death during VBAC > mother’s risk of death during primary vaginal birth
Mother’s risk of death during VBAC > baby’s risk of death during VBAC
When a doctor like the one you cite says something like that, it’s always a little suspect because people tend to truncate the statistics not to include all the variables.
Plus, people hear the word “higher” as “very high” when that may not be the case at all. My risk of being struck by a meteor is higher in my front yard than in my house, but it’s still infinitesimally small.
When the risk jumps from one in fifty-thousand to one in thirty-thousand, yes it’s a huge jump, but it’s still not that big of a risk.
Doctors don’t often quantify that risk, though. They just like to say, “Well, the risk gets higher for this.”
That’s why I like the amnio comparison other people are making. For some reason the 1:200 to 1:400 risk of miscarriage after an amnio is acceptable, but 1:200 to 1:400 risks for other things just aren’t something anyone can stand to take, and we must shame people who attempt to do so. :-b
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Details Reply:
May 16th, 2012 at 1:36 pm Details(Quote)
I knew the risk of mom dying with a RCS was higher. I was thinking more like 1.5 x higher but higher none the less. but I’m not so sure the risk to the baby is lower. I know the March of dimes was having a fit that Dr. were scheduling RCS at 37 weeks and babies were (maybe not dying) but landing in NICU with prematurity espeically lungs problems because the water doesn’t get squeezed out in a c-sections. I don’t happen to have a study of neonatal outcomes for RCS at 39-42 weeks. But I would love to see one. I think many people would like to believe that it is mom vs. baby and a choice has to be made, when VBAC is in fact better for both.
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