Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
Aug
18
Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
“I’m Doing This For Your Own Good!”
“I’m doing this for your own good!”- OB while doing perineal massage during pushing when the mother clearly requested the OB to stop.
There are 42 comments to this post.
I’m about to kick you in the face (repeatedly, until you stop), but I’m doing it for your own good.
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evelyn Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 6:50 am (Quote)
i actually DID kick my doc for this. though all i managed to get out was “stop” (couldn’t concentrate enough on speaking to form a full sentence), and he and my friends who were there helping thought i meant “make it stop,” as in make the pain stop. so i kicked him. he stopped and apologized. i love the fact that i can tell people i kicked my ob during delivery though. 
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I can actually understand where this doctor was coming from. Sometime the doctor really does know what is best. A perineal massage can seriously cut down on the risk of tearing. It may be painful at the time, but it IS much better than the long term pain from tearing.
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Heather Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 9:36 am (Quote)
Um, no. Actually studies haven’t shown this conclusively and not even all midwives recommend it anymore. Second, any time someone tells you not to touch their genitals and you continue, you’re sexually assaulting them, regardless of your profession.
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mommymichael Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 7:01 pm (Quote)
My care provider informed me that perineal massage during pregnancy can help, but perineal massage during PUSHING inflames the tissues. And inflamed tissues…don’t stretch as well. So when the baby crowns the tissues are more likely to tear.
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CNicole had this to say,
Aug 18, 2010 @ 5:52 am (Quote)
How awful!
Change the location to outside the hospital, take away the title of Doctor, any other man touching a woman’s genitals when she says “stop” it is assault. The comment makes it so much worse. As i understand it, attackers often have this blame the victim (“she deserved it” or “for her own good” attidude) It should be considered no less than assault in this situation.
So soory to the OP that this happened.
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Good grief. I’m glad informed consent means nothing. :-b
And CNicole, you’re absolutely right. In any other location, this would be considered sexual assault, but during labor, the woman is no longer a woman and her vagina is no longer her property. :-b
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Wow.. ya know doc, perineal massage really isn’t all that comfy. The nurse attending my birth did it and while it didn’t bother me, it definitely was uncomfy. If she said stop, you stop! Its not like she was telling you to not do something vital. The massage really isn’t vital, its a choice.. she chose no!
Op, sorry 
.
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Besides, there was actually a study that looked at this, and determined that routine perineal massage during labor did not help mothers avoid tearing; but perineal massage prior to labor did. So while the doc may have thought s/he was helping, the study says otherwise.
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Cmat Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 11:45 am (Quote)
Yep, definitely didn’t help me not tear lol. I tore in 3 places.
I think what might help a lot more is listening to your body and pushing when your body tells you to. Might also help to do something different than laying flat on your back.
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Serene Reply:
August 20th, 2010 at 4:47 am (Quote)
I actually found it really helpful. I wad PM with #2, after a 4* tear with #1, and the Ob was expecting to have to reconstruct me again, so even had the operating theatre prepped for me (small country hospital). Well I had no perineal tearing and only a small labial tear. I was thrilled. But they also used rosehip and calendula oils on the perineum to soften it.
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I actually have far less problem with this comment than with most I see on this site. Sure, the OB could have explained it better, and “no” DOES mean “no” even while in labor, but… an OB doing massage instead of just cutting an episiotomy or letting the woman tear? Sadly, my standards for OBs are so low that I find that pretty impressive. I wish my OB had tried perineal massage!
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Heather P Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 7:59 am (Quote)
I disagree. The OB that I had did perineal “massage” and I tore anyway. What might have prevented the tearing better would have been not purple pushing. They insisted that I push so hard that I burst blood vessels and went dizzy from the lack of oxygen.
Also, the perineal “massage” that I had was nothing like a massage. It hurt like hell. For my second baby nobody came near my perineum and I pushed how I damn well felt like and I only had a skid mark.
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Heather Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 9:39 am (Quote)
Except that, like Kathy said, a study was done showing that perineal massage in labor doesn’t help stop tearing (only perineal massage done prior to labor does), so the doctor had no place doing it, especially when she said “stop.”
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Jenn Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 9:48 am (Quote)
Interesting, I didn’t realize it didn’t help during labor. I’ve been making a list of the things I want to do before and during labor so that I don’t have to deal with a bad tear like that again (purple pushing combined with a doc who knew nothing other than to numb and cut- I may have been the doc’s first patient to go drug-free on purpose and she had no idea how to work with that).
And, as I said before, I definitely agree that when the woman said “stop” he should have stopped. I’m just too used to doctors who numb and do an episiotomy first thing without thought.
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Cmat Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 11:47 am (Quote)
Its supposed to help, but it doesn’t much. At least not for me. Like I said above, I had perineal massage and its more like hooking a finger over the skin and tugging down and slidding the finger side to side. At least that’s what the nurse did to me.
I don’t condem the doctor by any means. Just that no means no. I do applaud that they thought of something other than push push push, cut, push push push.
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Jane Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 2:41 pm (Quote)
I did perineal massage for four weeks prior to labor with my 3rd baby (about five minutes per day, once a day), and after about two weeks, I suddenly felt all the perineal tissues fan open under pressure. It was the most amazing thing, to suddenly feel my body “get it,” and the muscles all relax.
Not only did I not tear with that birth, but there was NO “ring of fire” sensation that time. I’ve never torn since then, either (two subsequent births.)
I highly recommend perineal massage prior to labor, when the mom is totally in control, will do it in such a way that it doesn’t hurt, and can gradually “teach” the vaginal tissue to open up and expand the way it was designed to.
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Aron Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 6:20 pm (Quote)
Yep. In fact the evidence suggests that vigorous massage *during* pushing can irritate the tissues, causing them to swell, thus leading to more tearing. And if you’re familiar with Ina May Gaskin’s “sphincter law” concept, she posits the theory that unfamiliar contact in the genitals cause the muscles to tense just as unfamiliar contact witht the anus causes that sphincter to tense/close. I don’t know how much hard science backs up her theory, but it makes sense to me and matches what I’ve personally witnessed.
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The Deranged Housewife had this to say,
Aug 18, 2010 @ 8:17 am (Quote)
I’m with Jenn – I have mixed feelings about this one. My first thought was, “An OB who actually does – much less *acknowledges* the perineal massage instead of just automatically doing an episiotomy?!” I know it’s got to be incredibly uncomfortable, but did it work?
I asked about perineal massage during my labor and was told “it’s too late for that.” Yet a friend who delivered at a Presbyterian Hospital in the African Congo had an American doctor (who practiced midwifery, really) do perineal massage on her during labor and it’s the only one she didn’t tear during out of her three births.
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“But I’m trying to prevent a tear.” would have been so much better than “I’m doing this for your own good.” I agree with those who hesitate to condem this doctor. At least he/she was trying. But they really have to listen and be respectful.
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Katy Reply:
August 18th, 2010 at 12:31 pm (Quote)
You nailed it. It’s not really that bad of a quote until you realize the person saying it was saying it to a woman who was working very hard and already hurting. There is no reason to treat her like a child. The OB is NOT in pain, they can remember to be polite and understanding.
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Kat had this to say,
Aug 18, 2010 @ 10:37 am (Quote)
It has been my experience that pushing had more effect on tearing or not than perineal massage or counterpressure. My first two times giving birth I got episiotomies.
My third, I tore a tiny bit up near my urethra, one stitch. Yeah, give me a tiny natural tear any day over being cut.
My 4th, born at home, I had *no* tearing. The midwife started to do counterpressure or something and I yelled “STOP IT!” She gently explained she was trying to help prevent tears. I said just stop, it hurts, and she did.
I pushed how my body wanted, and even panted through the last contraction before he came out. No one told me to, my body just did it. I had barely even a skid mark, and my recovery was so much easier.
I was glad that the midwife understood no means no, and that I was able to vocalize that No when I needed to. Hubby told me later I was kind of rude to the midwife. I said “No, I wasn’t.” I refuse to accept the label of “rudeness” on an action I took to protect myself from unnecessary and unwanted touching of my genitals. Not that I was mad at the midwife, she meant well, and she DID listen when I said stop.
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Eh, would the folks who are not sure about this comment feel differently if it were unwanted VE, amniotomy, cord traction, early cord cutting (or failure to collect cord blood), episiotomy, sedatives/pain killers, pitocin in non-emergency situation, tugging on the baby, cesarean section, giving vitamin K/eye drops/formula or sugar water or a pacifier to the baby particularly if wishes are already clearly known, circumcision, husband stitch, birth control shot or tubal ligation, or tossing out her placenta when she wanted to save it.. ?
Dear doctor,
If it isn’t wanted, a woman is saying or more accurately usually yelling at you NO – Don’t that hurts – Stop doing that – Quit doing that – DO NOT DO “insert action” – or – I do not consent! (or it is something you had to obtain consent for, or a woman provided explicit instructions and this isn’t a dire emergency), and they are still cognitively aware enough aka not unconscious or bleeding to death or the baby isn’t in extreme dire distress or it’s something entirely optional that she DECLINED.. if you can, which you probably almost always can, if appropriate you STOP what you’re doing and explain why it is either A. necessary or B. a good idea. and perhaps or perhaps do not obtain consent. If you do not obtain consent, you STOP and either plead your case if necessary – without badgering/insulting – or you move on if the situation is fitting. If it’s something optional, you either already know her wishes, or need to approach her at a different time about it.
You don’t just keep doing what you’re doing and yell back “It’s better this way/for your own good” (which screams of paternalism and outright assault) regardless of whether or not you honestly believe what you’re doing is a good idea or necessary.
And, as I’ve learned, maybe you’ve learned differently, but I’ve learned that perineal massage during birthing isn’t all that helpful, or can make things worse, anyway.
Next time. Use informed CONSENT, all the way! Okay?
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Stacie Hogan had this to say,
Feb 11, 2011 @ 12:05 pm (Quote)
No means no! I dont care what the intentions, good or bad. Mom says no, she means it. If you really feel its necessary, STOP, Explain your veiws then wait for consent. It is ASSAULT otherwise.
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Awesome that an ob was actually doing perineal massage but if the mother says stop, YOU STOP!!
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