Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
Jun
30
Posted by My OB said WHAT?!?.
“You Are Reading Too Much. You Are Asking Too Many Questions.”
“You are reading too much. You are asking too many questions.” -L&D nurse to a mother, during a phone call to get more information about cramping and bleeding in the first trimester, after the mother had had a previous miscarriage.
There are 35 comments to this post.
“Am I to understand then that you do not read medical information either? In that case, would you mind passing the phone to a different nurse? Thanks.”
The “too many questions” thing comes from the gold standard of a three minute office visit during which the patient spits out only the most important details and the physician makes a diagnosis on the spot and the patient leaves feeling fully informed.
In my experience, people who say things like the above do not know the answers and are trying to get the patient to stop putting them on the spot. 
It would be better to say, “I don’t know the answer to that, but I can find out and get back to you.”
(I’m assuming, of course, that the OP who submitted this was asking fairly standard questions and hadn’t called twenty-three times this week with questions along the line of whether she should shampoo her hair clockwise or counterclockwise to promote the health of the baby.)
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Wait a minute, an L&D nurse was willing to talk details over the phone??? You won’t get that here in the land of 47% c-sections and way too many lawyers. (Long Island) They would have told you to come to the ER or talk to your doctor. No nurse will diagnosis anything. And not even a doctor will tell you a thing over the phone. My GP won’t even call in a perscription refill. You have to have an appointment and bring the piece of paper to the pharmacy or mail it in yourself.
The best you might have gotten out of a L&D nurse here is a referal to a high risk specialist or more likely the hospital referal line’s phone number.
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Cmat Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 5:53 am (Quote)
My thoughts too. Only nurses I’ve ever dealt with that would talk any kind of details over the phone were the nurses from my son’s pediatrican’s office. They were just overall great ladies though. Then there was the nurse for our insurance’s 24hr line that was pretty great too. Never have I had any nurse outside of those two organizations talk to me longer than needed. Either an appointment is made or they say “I’ll talk to the doctor and call you back.” Or they direct you to the ER for something I wouldn’t normally think was worth a trip to the ER.
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 9:19 am (Quote)
Maybe we have a nurse who has impulse control problems and doesn’t mind risking her job to talk to a patient… whether kindly or rudely. If that’s the case, she’ll be too much of a liability to keep in that maternity ward for very long.
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Robbin Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 10:04 am (Quote)
Here in BC, Canada, we have a nursing help line where you can call to get advice on things such as this. When I miscarried at 10 weeks, we called to find out how much blood was too much, and we have called with questions about our two year old as well. They don’t really diagnose, persay, but they do tell you when to worry and when to not worry – when to see a doctor at a walk-in clinic or at the ER. In other words, whether or not you need care emergently.
To the PP who was laughed at and to the OP here… so sorry you were treated so insensitively. We were treated with nothing but kindness when we called the 24 hour help line here on every occasion, and that standard of care should exist across every HCP in the entire world. Particularly when it comes to the unpredictability of reproduction. Hope the OP’s pregnancy ended up a sticky one.
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Cmat Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 2:53 pm (Quote)
In the states its mostly insurance companies that have that set up. All but Cigna (and I may just not have seen the information) had a 24hr help line. I’ve met one bad apple through that, but most were very sweet. You can also call most hospitals and get medical advice, but I’ve had a bad experience with that. My 1yr old had a surgical procedure done that required general anesthesia and no one bothered to tell me that it can cause fevers when the anesthesia wears off. I called in in a panic that my one year old had a fever of 102, crying my eyes out because the day had already been so hard (though I give the doctor who did the surgery SO much credit, he personally carried my son back instead of wheeling him out on a bed) and the doctor just waved it off and told me not to worry about it. Now I hesitate to ever use that so called resource again because I don’t want to be made to feel like a moron for being worried.
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Sounds like Nurse Ratchet has worked a few too many shifts and needs a break. I’m going to give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she’s a bit overworked. Doesn’t excuse the comment, but explains it a little. I knew a few of those “I call 20 times a day” ladies and I bet they drove a few nurses to act like this towards other ladies that weren’t the cause, just the convenient target when the nurse reached her last nerve.
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mommymichael had this to say,
Jun 30, 2010 @ 6:51 am (Quote)
otherwise it was a bad way of saying “you’re over thinking this… and the nurse was thinking she wasn’t miscarrying?? either way, bad way to say things. i hope mom/baby were okay.
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch had this to say,
Jun 30, 2010 @ 9:16 am (Quote)
“I don’t like intelligent, informed, assertive, independent freethinkers. They aren’t grateful or obedient enough. GOOD patients are docile and situationally stupid, like Guernsey cows. I want you to be more like that. Oh, and please, kill the melodrama. I know you’ve been through a lot, but there’s no need to burden us with it. Maybe you should talk to a counselor if you have feelings that need to be dealth with.”
Oh, nurse? I’ll be switching to another practice now (or, alternately, if I have a REALLY good relationship with my doctor, and s/he doesn’t have admitting privileges at any other hospitals, filing a complaint about you to your manager, to the hospital administrator, and to the ombudsman.) Have a nice day.
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This is DEFINITELY the experience I had with DS’s birth, and also with just about anything else medical I’ve had to deal with. I really don’t think the majority (I know, I know–there are wonderful exceptions) of health care providers WANT patients reading up on their conditions (even at reputable websites like Web MD and Mayo). The attitude I’ve seen is “Hey, I’m the doctor, not you, and I’m the one with the specialized info, not you.” I have a Ph.D. I know I’m not a medical expert, but I have a brain, and I have downloaded medical articles from JAMA, Lancet, and elsewhere–maybe the pharmacology/highly complex clinical stuff is beyond me, but I can certainly read the actual narrative just fine, thanks.
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sara Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 10:10 am (Quote)
Yeah, I’ve been having some thyroid problems and I went for a check-up the other day and at the end the doctor said, “okay Ms. WebMD, we need to see you back in a week”. Hahaha. I’m not sure if she meant it in a good way, or not, but I took it as a compliment. If I were a doctor I would like patients who actually paid attention to their symtoms and looked them up on the internet. It would make my job easier!
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 11:37 am (Quote)
The NHS doctors I had when I was in England, and the doctor I was seeing when I lived in Cincinnati, were the sort who liked my being well-informed and aware, even if it did make me a little bit higher maintenance because I took a few minutes of extra time gathering yet more information from them.
I miss them.
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laurie Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 10:19 am (Quote)
For my first pregnancy, the doc wouldn’t spend the time to talk to me. So how am I supposed to know what’s “normal” for pregnancy? I look it up!! If they don’t like it, they should talk to us…nicely!!
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Jane Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 4:07 pm (Quote)
Because OBs are surgeons. They should be performing surgery during high-risk pregnancy complications.
Regular prenatal visits should be conducted by midwives whose training is in healthy,normal pregnancies (who are also trained to screen for higher risk conditions.) They could then spend half an hour to an hour answering questions and discussing nutrition and the like.
The system we have is broken, funneling all women into care by high-risk surgeons regardless of actual risk factors.
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As far as I’m concerned, any medical professional that is not GLAD that I’m a well-informed, well-read patient is not going to be my care provider. I don’t do things just because seomeone else told me to without a reason. I didn’t do that when I was eight, and I’m SURE not going to do it 30 years later!
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Cmat Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 2:45 pm (Quote)
I wish I could say the same, but I’m actually very afraid that I won’t be able to. The area in Wisconsin where I live is small, my choices will be limited. I’ll be shocked if I can find a Midwife in my area (even within an hour) and in all probability my choices of OBs will be between two, three at the most and that’s a long shot. If I can’t get a midwife and have to deal with an OB (a bad one) then I’m going to hope that getting an incense and twinkle light toting doula won’t be too expensive!
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 6:23 pm (Quote)
As around and see if you can find a trainee who is going for her DONA, CAPPA, or ALACE certification. They generally offer their services for free or cheap, in exchange for the experience that they can write up to help get certified. If the two of you hit it off well and share a similar philosophy of birth, experience isn’t nearly as important. 
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Dee Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 6:42 pm (Quote)
Cmat, for pretty much that reason, I’ve been traveling about an hour for most of my recent medical care (herniated disks in neck, kidney stones) to the state teaching hospital. Maybe it’s because they’re students. Maybe it’s because I’m a teacher, but generally speaking, they’ve bent over backwards to answer questions, respect my intelligence, give handouts, and so on. Granted, I’m not talking OBGYN care (not having more kids–though I wish I’d known about them for DS–had to have been better than the doctor I had), and granted they look 12 years old, lol, but it’s a start…What do you know about the local OBs? Any good ones in the small bunch?
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Cmat Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 7:54 pm (Quote)
Sarah- I saw postings on craigslist in my old area for a similar situation. Literally drooled over it and hoped I could trip over that again for my next pregnancy! I do plan to look into that.
Dee- According to my MIL (dh’s stepmom, she’s never had kids of her own though) the OBGYN at the local practice is very good. But then again.. like I mentioned she’s never had children so never dealt with said OB on that level. I’m still hoping I can manage to find a midwife though.
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Heather Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 8:51 pm (Quote)
WI’s midwives are truly legal now (they used to be sort of extra-legal) & most of the very rural areas have good-sized Amish/Mennonite populations (I grew up in Sheboygan County, & lived in several other places around the state before moving away), & the Amish and Mennonites will have midwives, but it might take some asking around,
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Cmat Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 8:21 am (Quote)
Ah, I’m in Iron county, right on the border of Michigan in the UP. I’ll have to look into that. Thanks Heather .
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Roni Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 12:51 pm (Quote)
Have you looked on the Wisconsin Guild of Midwives site? They have a listing of midwives in Wisconsin there.
Also, don’t be too discouraged about finding a midwife in a rural area. I live in rural Wisconsin also and I know of at least 3 homebirth midwives practicing within 30 minutes of my house.
Good luck
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Cmat Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 6:11 pm (Quote)
Actually I found that site today. DH and I have been talking about ttc our next little one so I thought I’d get started now! No luck on that site though. I had to go up to the 50 mile option to find one. I’m hoping I can do some asking around and see what pops up. I may even call someone from the website mentioned and find out if they know of anyone in my area.
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WOW.
You’d think health care professionals would ENJOY an informed, intelligent patient….*sigh*
When I miscarried, I called the ER once I began to bleed; the nurse who answered laughed it off and told me it was normal. Well, maybe so, but I still ended up MISCARRYING. Geez.
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 9:21 am Sarah Dorrance-Minch(Quote)
She laughed at you even though she knew you were starting to miscarry?!? How awful…
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Lauren Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 2:53 pm Lauren(Quote)
You know, neither of us KNEW I was miscarrying yet, but she laughed off my concerns. So while I don’t think she meant to hurt me, it sure didn’t help matters.
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Jessa Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 11:22 am Jessa(Quote)
I got laughed at too during my first miscarriage. I went to the ER to find out what was happening and they refused to give me an ultrasound, refused to let me see a dr, and kept telling me that my baby was being aborted and “it’s for the better”. (I later found out that in the medical world a miscarriage is referred to as a ‘spontaneous abortion’ but it didn’t make it hurt any less at the time)
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 11:33 am Sarah Dorrance-Minch(Quote)
I usually have good rapport with ER personnel (I’m a frequent flyer, because when my migraines don’t respond to “rescue” drugs, there’s only so much pain I’ll take before I beg for something strong – I can do natural childbirth, but not “natural” migraines).
I’ve never been to an ER for a miscarriage, though. I keep hearing about ER nurses being rude to women who are miscarrying. That’s just so wrong. Surely some of them are mothers and would know better than to treat it so offhandedly?
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Jane Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 12:27 pm Jane(Quote)
I think it’s a natural response of someone who is normally in the position of “savior” to degrade the value of anything she cannot save. The ER nurses are used to making heroic efforts to save heart attack victims, gunshot victims, drug overdose victims, and so on. A woman walks in having a miscarriage and for the majority of them, there is not one. single. thing. they. can. do.
So the more burnt-out nurses and doctors laugh it off. When someone gets to that point where patients are just nasty people who keep you from being able to sit down even once during your 12-hour-shift, if they can’t fix it, it wasn’t worth fixing in the first place.
I really think burnout is the #1 cause behind the nasty comments we see posted at this site.
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CCindy Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 12:50 pm CCindy(Quote)
Thank you for your insight Jane.
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Sarah Dorrance-Minch Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 2:40 pm Sarah Dorrance-Minch(Quote)
Could somebody explain to me why people stay in careers they obviously hate when they’re burned out, rather than getting retrained in another field or simply trying something new (depending on the level of education required)? I don’t get it. Every time I’ve found myself in a job I found I really hated, I switched to something else. It probably didn’t do wonders for my resume, but I don’t do “misery.” It just isn’t my cup of tea.
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Jane Reply:
June 30th, 2010 at 4:02 pm Jane(Quote)
Because the money is good.
Because after a certain point in the burnout, the burned-out person doesn’t even see it any longer.
Because when a person is that burnt-out, he doesn’t see himself as the problem. He remembers that in the past the job was fun, and decides it’s the fault of the current patients rather than a fault in his perceptions.
Because leaving and retraining would be a scary thing, especially if this has been the only career the person ever considered.
Because one component of burnout is tunnel vision.
Signs of caregiver burnout here: http://caringfortheaged.suite101.com/article.cfm/signs_of_caregiver_burnout
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sandi Reply:
July 1st, 2010 at 2:06 pm sandi(Quote)
as a nursing student (that is planning on going to to become a midwife, CNM) i cannot tell you the number of people i am in classes with that are all abotu the lack of work and excess of money…some of my fellow students have told me that that i am nuts due to the amount of education and work required to be a midwife and the lack of payment *head desk*
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